Episode 1: Spooky Series: Spirits, Haunted Places, and Tarot Readings 

Available on Soundcloud, Spotify, and Apple Music @TheRunnerOnAir  

Music Credits: 

Intro & Outro Song- 

Detective  

By AShamaluevMusic  

TRANSCRIPT:  

[Taylor Redstone]: Hello, Hello! This is Taylor Redstone, and this is the first installment of our Spooky Series here at The Runner. I am so happy to be here with Isis Soto, and Isis is a student here at CSUB, and she has a lot of really cool paranormal experiences and has visited some really interesting places. So, we’re gonna be talking about that, and we’re gonna be touching on Tarot Readings, and it’s gonna be a really fun time! So, I am so happy to welcome Isis! So, you can kind of just talk about like your background with the subject, how you got into it… 

[Isis Soto]: Okay, okay, so as a kid I’ve always liked scary stuff. I’ve always believed in like magic and supernatural stuff. I thought that it was possible, and when I was a kid, I must have been about four years old, and I had invisible friends. I would talk to two twins, I guess, like spirits, that’s what my mom said they were. I was too little to really remember, but they caught me several times and they’d like ‘who are you talking to?’ and I’m like ‘Oh, I’m talking to my friends’, and I mean imagine, that’d be creepy to like to hear a kid say that. So that’s kind of where it started, and I’ve always liked scary stuff as I mentioned.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, and I guess when you’re a child, it’s very, like you don’t know what’s not there and there. So, it’s very innocent. But did you, were you drawn to sort of scary movies, or did you start seeing anything else?  

[Isis Soto]: Not at that time, I didn’t see anything else that I remember. But scary movies, yeah. Like I’ve always liked.  I mean people always say I have [illegible] issues because I’ve always liked going on haunted tours, but I just like the suspense, you know? in all kinds of like horror movies. And also, Like I’m a big fan of “The Conjuring…”  

[Taylor Redstone]: …Oh! “The Conjuring!” That’s awesome! Yeah. 

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, like that type of stuff too. I mean I believe in all that. So, the next time I’ve ever seen anything that I remember, I was probably like 11. And I remember we were coming home from the fair, and we had the front door locked so my family told me, ‘Oh, go around the house that we had the back door unlocked, or like go unlock the door for us. ‘Okay’ Go around, and it was routine, we would do that, you know. So, it was never, it wasn’t scary to me going in the dark. So I go, and I remember I turned on the kitchen light and I see this young boy, and he must have been in the era of the 1920’s, the way he was dressed, like those little hats… He had the stockings, like kind of capri looking… just stare at me, and like I stared again closer. And then he was gone. So, I was always like Ehh, you know, ‘What was it?’ That’s when it first started. And like recently, I found out, so the house that we lived in at the time, it was like a family house, different family members lived there throughout the years, like no one died there, but just different family members. And one of my uncles, he saw the same thing. I found that out recently. So, it kind of justified it for me.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, it’s always validating when someone else sees what you saw. And you’re okay.  

[Isis Soto]: Yes, because I never mentioned it to them, so for them to describe that. … 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah… where it’s like okay… 

[Isis Soto]: I was like maybe I’m not crazy.  

 [Taylor Redstone]: Yeah. I think that it’s really crazy when like, you know, you’re…When you think about seeing an apparition, like or seeing a ghost. You…I think people like have this idea of what it is, but like for yours, was it misty?  

[Isis Soto]: Yes  

[Taylor Redstone]: Or was it like full?  

[Isis Soto]: No, it looked, it did look like you said misty. Like, I could see him dressed but it wasn’t like a whole body. Almost… 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, he wasn’t like…He was almost like translucent.  

 [Isis Soto]: Yes, there you go. And it’s weird to describe it, but yeah that’s how he looked. It was so weird.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, where it’s like an image but it’s kind of like, faded a little.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, and you know, maybe he just, that was where he played so he was just… 

[Isis Soto]: …Yeah, and this house is in Shafter. So later we found out more history about the house and this lady that used to work at the school, my mom worked at the school and one of her co-workers, she grew up in Shafter, she passed away now, but she was, since she was little right, so she remembers that house always being there, and like her friends. So that house has a lot of history. It was there for a long time, since for sure the 40’s.  

[Taylor Redstone]: And like, yeah, I think… when people live somewhere for so long. Maybe they don’t even know they’re there. It’s kind of like an echo of what they kind of were, or something like that. But I think like, something that draws me to like ghosts and this whole thing, is this idea that like there’s continuance.  

[Isis Soto]: Yesss 

[Taylor Redstone]: Like they’re not just, we’re not just like… that’s it…we’re gone. I don’t know, it’s cool that there’s like… 

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, and I mean there’s been a few more situations, see now I handle it different though. Now I’m not scared.  

[Taylor Redstone]: ohhh. Yeah.  

[Isis Soto]: But when I was younger, like yeah. I mean, the next time I remember something was like, I was 19 years old, and at the time I was living with my uncle, we lived out in the country, kind of between like Wasco and Shafter, like off the 46 and Lerdo Highway, it was pretty far. And I would always sleep with my door open, so my bed would lean against the wall, I had my door, and I was facing my TV. And from the TV, I could see a reflection of someone at the door and like I kept staring towards the TV, I didn’t want to look. Like I don’t know if you’ve ever had that feeling of being scared. Like there’s been a few times that I don’t want to look because whatever’s there, it’s not good. It’s weird to tell you, I didn’t want to look, and all I did was cover my head with a blanket and just force myself to go to sleep.  

[Taylor Redstone]: You just, yeah you couldn’t face whatever that was.  

[Isis Soto]: So then the next day I wanted to make sure like oh maybe there was something in the hallway. There was nothing there, there was nothing there that could’ve made that shadow, whatever darkness I seen. And see whenever it’s been like, I want to say evil spirits maybe that I’ve seen, it’s dark. It’s a dark… 

[Taylor Redstone]: It’s darker than like black. Yeah.  

[Isis Soto]: I don’t even really see anybody, it’s just dark, it’s creepy. So, like last year, well I mentioned I went to see Bad Bunny, right?  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh yeah! 

[Isis Soto]: So last year, I went and seen him, and I stayed in El Segundo, like kind of by LAX area. And this hotel, I decided Oh, I’m gonna upgrade to like a nicer suite, which it was kind of like a cheap hotel anyway. So, it was a weird setup of a hotel, but you could tell it was really old. So, I was there getting ready, and the restroom had where your sink is, your lights, your mirror, but then next to it was the actual you know toilet and stuff, so you could close the door. And the light would just turn on and off, on and off. And it was like a sensor, which that’s what was tripping me out because there was nothing in there.  

[Taylor Redstone]: ohhh, yeah, like it had to be movement to…  

[Isis Soto]: So, I was kind of busy getting ready, so I’m like let me hurry up because I need to get there early, catch the show, so I didn’t pay it any attention. So, then the next day, same thing, it’s doing it again like, and so I close the door, I’m like let me close the door maybe it’s cause how I’m getting ready it’s picking up movement from me, I don’t know, close the door, and then it was still doing it so then finally I just left it opened, and it turned off. And then I said it out loud. I said, ‘if there’s a spirit here, show yourself” and the light turned on as soon as I said that.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh my gosh  

[Isis Soto]: And then I kind of looked around and I was like ‘Oh my gosh!’ So, I mentioned I met a friend in LA right? Like when I went to a concert, so I told him ‘hey is there any way you could come back and stay with me now? Cause I’m kind of scared.  

[Taylor Redstone]: yeah, and you talked to it!  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah! So, he couldn’t anymore so I’m like damn. So, I went downstairs to the bar, and I started talking to the people there and I’m like, ‘is this place haunted?’ and the bartender and the waitress looked at each other and just started laughing.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh my gosh, like people probably every night say something.  

[Isis Soto]: and I’m like hey!! So yeah, they said that strange stuff happens at that hotel all the time. So that’s like one place that I went that shouldn’t have been haunted, but I’m like what the heck? 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, that just, it was.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, yeah.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Well as far as like, you mentioned like darker or bad spirits, do you, can you feel like the energy of it, or is it kind of like?  

[Isis Soto]: No, I’m gonna say the energy.  Like another story I have happened at my house, and like I said, now I’m not scared of stuff. I’ll walk in the dark, like before.  I mean there’s some people who need every light on as they’re walking. I’ll just go in the dark to the kitchen.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, you’re comfortable.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, like it’s not scary for me. So, I went and did, you know the normal routine, filled up my water. I’m walking back and then I see something by our front door. And then, the thing is, my mom has kind of like this kind of shelf, she has a bunch of collections, it has a mirror on it, that’s the point, right? It has a mirror and I just seen something dark right there. And like, this is where I tell you, you know, I’m never scared of anything. I’m never scared. But I didn’t want to turn and look. I was like I don’t know what the heck that was, like I was just trying to hurry up and go back in my room. I’m like what was that. So, I bought sage and I saged our house.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh Yeah! 

[Isis Soto]: I was like Uh Uh. I’m never scared of anything.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah like, well and do you think that like this is always, you know, I always read things that go back and forth. There’s like one side of the like paranormal community, that they believe in like demonic entities, and things like that. But there’s other, you know, people that they believe in all of it, but they don’t think it’s like a demon. They just call it like a lower entity spirit, like where it’s just like lower, it’s not necessarily like a thing from a physical hell.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, like a demon. I get you.  

[Taylor Redstone]: But it’s more…But I don’t know. I feel like there might be a difference between the two. Like there could be maybe a darker spirit, but then there’s something else maybe. I don’t know.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, Yeah, I get you. I mean I don’t know. Like I said, and I mean I’m spiritual, to me that’s my belief. 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, me too.  

[Isis Soto]: I’m like a very spiritual person so I go off energy and to me whatever that was like didn’t feel right.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, so you just like, and it’s just like you listen to your intuition. Like the first thing that comes up.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, I just didn’t even want to turn and look. Like I said I just remember walking back towards my room and here I just seen something and I kind of looked and looked at the mirror and just seen a dark shadow, and just kept walking. You know, like we’re not doing this.  

[Taylor Redstone]: and especially because, you mentioned you can typically like assert dominance over whatever it was. Like okay, is this a? You know. But like there’s a different feeling when it’s like ooo, that wasn’t quite right.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah. And so like, I want to say maybe a month and a half ago, that’s the last time I noticed something creepy like that. And this is at my brother’s house. He lives off Coffee, or Olive and Coffee I think, so he lives like in a nice neighborhood, it’s newer, it’s not old houses. And since he’s lived there like there’s been a few times that I’ve been there by myself, and you hear noises, like but there’s nobody else in the house. But you know, whatever, like if I can’t really figure out what it is, I’m not gonna freak out. And he’s mentioned it too that right, he’d like trip out sometimes. He’d be alone gaming and then like thought he hears stuff. So me and him, we don’t see each other too much, so I was gonna go out and I’ll usually stay at his house. Since he lives here in town and I live in Shafter, I’ll stay at his house. And we were talking before my ride was getting here, and I turn and look at him, and I face his kitchen, he has his back toward the kitchen, and this time, it almost sounds silly, but it almost looked like the grim reaper looking thing, like a shadow like that.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh my gosh. and the cloak?  

[Isis Soto]: Like it was just like they were wearing a hood or something. It was a hood, something hooded. But they really didn’t have a face, it was just dark. And my brother just laughed because my face, I like broke in tears. Like whatever that was like.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah.  

[Isis Soto]:  He’s just, he’s like ‘are you okay? What happened?’ and I’m like ‘I don’t know but I just seen something there.’ And he’s like ‘for reals?’ I’m like ‘yes!’ like so creepy!  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, it’s jarring! It’s upsetting. 

[Isis Soto]:  Yeah, so yeah, he’s like, I mean he knows cause he’s heard stuff. But he just said like my face. So like so I mean, I’ve seen both you know just random things, I mean the thing at the hotel where the light turned on like whatever it was didn’t…I’ve gone to several haunted museums but never seen nothing haunted there.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Really? Have you heard that the Garces Circle is haunted? Like Father Garces.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.  

[Taylor Redstone]: So that’s always, that’s a fun story. And I’m trying to  

[Isis Soto]: Well, they say The Padre, I mentioned right, that I stayed there, and each time I go I ask for the seventh floor. I mean, I looked into it and they say families died on the seventh floor because of a fire.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh yeah… 

[Isis Soto]:  But I never felt or seen anything at all.  

[Taylor Redstone]: And they also, there was also this handprint in one of the rooms that stays…  

[Isis Soto]:  Oh, that appears? Yeah, yeah and they say, I’ve heard the suites are too. I guess that’s the eighth floor. I’ve never stayed up there, but they look really fancy and stuff, so I’d imagine. The hotel’s so old.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, I think it would be crazy to see something there.  

[Isis Soto]: Right?  

[Taylor Redstone]: I feel like, yeah, you’re definitely more likely to catch it somewhere else than like a haunted place. But I’m sure there’s like places where there’s like all sorts of hot spots.  

[Isis Soto]: Yea different. In Vegas, I went to Zach, I think his last name is Baganez [Bagan]’s show on Sci-Fi.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, I think I’ve heard of that. 

[Isis Soto]: I mean this was years ago, this was like in 2018 when I went, and he has like a, it’s a haunted like artifact. He has the Annabelle chair.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh Yeah! 

[Isis Soto]: Like he just has a bunch of random haunted things in there. And same thing, I didn’t feel or like nothing scared me. The only thing that scared me and I knew it was, they had a little narrow hallway that had clowns lined up and I’m not scared of clowns but I’m like one of them is gonna grab me and you can’t tell which one’s real or fake.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh like yeah you do that whole thing yeah.  

[Isis Soto]: Yea and it was a group of… 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah… it’s, I don’t know, I feel like everybody’s kind of drawn to it. It’s just a very human thing to like that kind of stuff. It’s just one of those things.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah…oh and see you it’s either like you like it or you don’t like it. Like the few guys that I’ve dated or talked to never liked scary stuff. I mean they’ll tolerate it cause of me, they’re like ‘fine!’ But for the most part, they’re like ‘no, no, no!’ So yeah, not a lot of people like scary stuff. I’ve also been to the Winchester Mansion.   

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, you went there? Oh my gosh! 

[Isis Soto]: Yes, it’s beautiful. It’s a beautiful random house, cause like it is true that the stuff leads to nowhere, staircases… 

[Taylor Redstone]: She was trying to trip the ghosts up.  Oh my gosh.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, yeah, like doors that are nothing. I mean, but it’s just really beautiful.  

[Taylor Redstone]: So, she really attributes those hauntings to the invention of the [a] gun? 

[Isis Soto]:  Yeah, I mean, Have you seen the movie? I mean yeah that’s what it says 

[Taylor Redstone]: Because that’s a crazy concept that this thing that’s responsible for so many deaths… 

[Isis Soto]:  These spirits haunt her.  

[Taylor Redstone]: …so many you know violent deaths. I think they say that the more violent a death is, the more likely a spirit will be unable to cross over. So that’s crazy. Oh my gosh.  

[Isis Soto]:  So Yeah, but nothing, like I said, same thing there. Nothing scary.  

[Taylor Redstone]: You just got to see all of the rooms and stairways.  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, they take you on a whole nice tour and it was right around when the movie came out too, so they had at the end of the tour, I remember, like the lady from the movie like how she had the black belts that they had her on display and some of the movie stuff.   

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, that’s so cool! I feel like that’s even just cool even if you don’t see anything crazy. Like it’s just cool to be there  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, just to see it. Cause I mean like in the movie, it mentions like how expensive the house was especially at that time to make it and stuff, and all the work they put into that house.  

[Taylor Redstone]: She just kept having people work in the rooms. Oh my gosh That’s crazy. Have you heard of [The] Queen Mary?  

[Isis Soto]: Oh yeah, I’ve visited there. I didn’t get to do the haunted tour. But I’m actually gonna stay there in December.  

[Taylor Redstone]: That’s so exciting! 

[Isis Soto]: Yeah! Cause they started opening it again cause it was closed for awhile cause of covid, so the friend that I have out there in LA, we’re gonna stay out there and do the haunted tour and like I said, he doesn’t like scary stuff but we’re gonna try and see if it’s haunted. So, we’ll see.  

 [Taylor Redstone]: Well, everybody… I’ve heard that everybody who goes there to have an experience like that usually does. Like it’s one of those like high activity places.  

[Isis Soto]: Oh shoot! 

[Taylor Redstone]: So that’s crazy. Oh my gosh. You’ll have to like take pictures and stuff.  

[Isis Soto]: Oh yeah, yeah for sure. So yeah, in December I plan to go, pretty much as soon as the semester ends. That’s my treat.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh yeah, definitely! Oh my gosh, I feel like that’d be cool in the wintertime too. 

[Isis Soto]:  Yeah, they probably have it all decorated, that’s true yeah.   

[Taylor Redstone]: This is maybe a little bit, like kind of off track of ghosts, but do you, like do you get signs, like do you experience any like any you know, like symbols that are significant to you that kind of happen?  

[Isis Soto]: Hmm, no I wouldn’t say that. Like I told you, I have spiritual beliefs, so I’m drawn a lot by like energy, manifesting, the planets, like things like that.  

[Taylor Redstone]: oh yeah! 

[Isis Soto]: A lot of that, like it’s really strange. I mean, But like I said, manifesting for sure. Like that’s one thing that  

[Taylor Redstone]: That’s awesome, I love that. Do you have any like certain methods that you do, or do you kind of just, is it more of just an everyday process.  

[Isis Soto]: A little bit of because I feel like when you manifest something, you still have to put in the work. It’s not like you’re just like alright, great, I’m gonna do this. Like you know you take steps towards it. But I mean, what I started doing in the past two years, I make a goal list, right, and I’ll put things like academically, stuff for my kids, stuff for me. And I start at the beginning of the year, and I’ll put three months in, six months in, all the way to the end of the year. And then, but I don’t really look at it, I just do it once, and then there at the end of the year I’ll look at it. And it’s gonna be the second year in a row that I’ve accomplished at least 80% of the list without even looking at it.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Wow! So, when you like put it down, and you put it out there, it was like…  

[Isis Soto]: and I mean, I do…like I said it’s just like, I mean your energy. I really do believe in like people’s energy and your own energy; it has to be good like you have to put good out there and it comes back to you. So, I mean that’s where my spiritual beliefs, like you said, as far as like signs and stuff, I wouldn’t say signs, but almost like form of the lifestyle that I’ve changed now is just to let life happen, like to let go of the control of things…  

[Taylor Redstone]: To kind of surrender to things 

[Isis Soto]: …which is hard because me, I’m really organized. I’m super organized, like girl I will plan things like so ahead and follow through, like I won’t just plan it, I’ll follow through, you know? So, to learn to live that lifestyle and change it now to just letting, like I say, like the Universe just letting it do what it needs to do, you know? Because worrying has never gotten you anywhere. So, whatever’s gonna happen, I mean, you could have a plan and it doesn’t go the way you wanted it to, then what, you know?  

[Taylor Redstone]: Exactly.  

[Isis Soto]: It’s more, like I said, The Universe, like my beliefs along with like astrology. I believe in astrology and things like that too.   

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, yea I love that! Yeah!  

[Isis Soto]: I mean I don’t get caught up in it too much. Where it’s like Oh it said this, and this gonna happen. It’s not so serious to me.  

[Taylor Redstone]: It’s more so just like themes, basically like. or just sort of yeah. Do you, have you…Are you into horoscopes? Or are you more like into the different houses and different… 

[Isis Soto]: A little bit of both, cause I mean recently I learned about how you have, I mean, you have your different signs right like you have your rising sign, your moon sign, and then your sun sign. So that’s why some people can be the same, like you’re a cancer but then you were born in a different moon, it depends where you’re at, all those things really make a difference. And like, for example, I have two co-workers that they’re both on the same day, but they’re freakin’ opposite of each other. One’s super easy going and the other one’s more business, you know like straightforward.  

 [Taylor Redstone]: So, it can, yea it’s very like, there’s, it’s complex. 

[Isis Soto]: Yea but there’s different dynamics. And you know some people might be like ‘oh my god’ cause the moon, I reference the moon all the time. 

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, me too, I love the moon! 

[Isis Soto]: But like I always tell people if the moon can affect waves, it has energy to change emotions and do stuff.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah! Like if it can control the tides, like how can it not affect humans? And you know, they say like the ER nurses always report that there’s crazier activity- 

[Isis Soto]: Oh, in the full moon, huh. yeah. For sure.  

[Taylor Redstone]: I absolutely think, like even when you’re driving, and it’s a full moon, like people are more aggressive. And it’s I don’t know I think it’s- 

[Isis Soto]: People are on the edge. No, it is! No, I think people’s energy it is it’s higher when the, so that’s what I mean like I wouldn’t say so much like signs and stuff but it’s things like that that kind of I follow through being through being spiritual. I do Tarot readings; I do believe in that too.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh yeah! And when you do Tarot, do you use the traditional Tarot, or do you do more like oracle cards?   

[Isis Soto]: I do more traditional, I do have oracle too, but I try not to get too caught up in it either because I feel like that’s kinda bad, like you get obsessed like your readings like ‘oh my god, what’s gonna happen, what’s gonna happen?’ Cause most of the times that I’ve done readings for myself, you know I’ll ask questions to the spirit world, I’m like ‘okay, what about this, what about this’ and most of the time, it’s spot on. But like I said, now I’ just kind of, I’ll do it once a month.  

[Taylor Redstone]: Oh, yea so it’s not like you’re doing a daily kind of thing, yeah cause you do get caught up- 

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, daily or weekly, yeah nothing crazy. You get caught up, like you get anxiety then you’re like overthinking. That’s how I, I used to feel like overthinking everything cause you’re like Is this what the cards are referring to?  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah like ‘oh did this card mean I should’ve not done this?’ Yeah.  

[Isis Soto]: Because I know some people frown on that too, cause like ‘Oh you’re messing with Tarot cards, that’s like you know “evil”, but I’m like no- 

[Taylor Redstone]: I think it’s just cool that there’s, you know, if you have an opportunity to interact with “The Other” I think, you know, even if people, I feel like people get scared but, and just get really turned off by it, like “Oh Ouija boards, Tarot” they’re very… but I don’t know, we’re living. So it’s like-  

[Isis Soto]: Yeah, Well you know, you said Ouija board, I think I would draw the line there.  I wouldn’t want to find out! 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, well I think like… it’s very like I think even when that fear is there, it’s kind of like, they’re already gonna win when you-. And so, it’s like. Yeah, I’ve never done like a Ouija board, but I do Tarot and stuff. And then, I’ve used a pendulum, and that get’s really scary because you just ask it things- 

[Isis Soto]: And it, Oh, I mean like I said with Tarot, Oh I believe you. Cause there’s times too where I’m like, you know, I mean, I’ll be honest, like a love reading, like ‘oh what’s so and so, you know, thinking or what’s on their mind?’ and or like, there’s times like nothing, like your cards, nothing will come out- 

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, just like duds  

[Isis Soto]: Or there’s times when you ask, and it’s like all the cards wanna come out. And I’m like oh my god, so it’s, it’s strange…  

[Taylor Redstone]: Yeah, so it really is a fascinating topic, and it can go in so many different directions. I think that when you have an open mind, and you are willing to push the boundary of possibility, it can make for a really fun time, really fun discussion, really fun thought experiments. And yeah, I think it taps into something really fundamental about humans, that we’re all very curious about the afterlife, and there’s part of us that kind of enjoys being scared to a certain degree. And yeah, I’m so happy I got to sit with Isis and have this really interesting conversation. And I really encourage everyone out there to sort of embrace their spooky sides during the spooky season, and yeah, thank you so much for listening!